I grew up in England and moved to Oz with my Australian girlfriend after I graduated . I lived in Melbourne for the next 3 years and had a great time, but towards the end of the 3 years realised that better weather wasn’t everything in life. I had reached a bit of a dead-end career-wise (due in no small part to Aussie bureaucracy) and decided to move home about a year ago.
Coming back to the UK felt like waking up from a deep sleep. The speed with which things happen was really refreshing and things that I’d taken for granted previously suddenly became really appreciated.
Some of the people on this website (and in general) strike me as incredibly naive with regards to Australia, making comments about the place either without ever being there or having just arrived and blinded by sunshine. They seem to think that moving to Oz will result in one big beach party, one never ending barbeque and talk about the place as if it was the garden of eden. Sorry, it isn’t.
Being realistic, you will do essentially the same things as you do here: commute to work, work, commute to home, eat, watch TV, go out, sleep, repeat, repeat, weekend. Having held several jobs in Oz, I worked with a vast number of different of local people, primarily in a similar age bracket (20-30) and of a similar background (relatively middle-class and mostly degree-educated). This pattern generally holds true.
Unless you live in London you are likely to spend longer on your commute in Australian cities. Many of my friends thought nothing of travelling an hour each way to work, in fact several even had longer journeys combining driving to their local train station, catching a train into the city and then tram to their office. Very concentrated CBDs and virtually unchecked suburban sprawl means that people often live huge distances from their place work. I now live on the edge of Leeds, 5 miles from the city centre. In Melbourne this would be classed as an inner suburb. Where I live now is walking distance from rolling hills, cows, sheep, literally a couple of miles to the Dales.
The unemployment rate is higher in Oz and depending on what industry you work in, you are likely to find more job opportunities in the UK and likely to get paid more for the same work, especially if you are a skilled professional. If you don’t live in the South-East of England, the cost of living is very similar. Coming from the Yorkshire, I actually found Sydney expensive and Melbourne comparable. There are overs and unders, sure, but averaged out across a ‘Basket of Goods’ prices were very close – its certainly not as cheap as the States and not nearly as cheap as smug locals would have you believe.
You seem to get more public holidays in Australia but less annual leave. 4 weeks is standard, where many employers in the UK now offer 5 or even 6 weeks (even if it is salary-sacrificed into flexible benefits packages). The holidays are all bunched up around Christmas – that’s also their summer holiday because of the reversed seasons. Apart from Afl, nothing seems to happen there over winter (actually most of the year round come to think of it).
With your time off their is infinitely more things to do in the UK, or at least from the UK. Generally 2 hours travelling time is what you want to arrive at your destination of choice. Within 2 hours I could be in Paris. 2 hours from Melbourne and i’d be driving through never-ending nothingness, on the way to Wolf Creek probably.
Having been back in the UK for about 12 months, I have had a much outdoors lifestyle than in Oz. It may be warmer there, but you seem to spend your life in an air-conditioned cocoon. Since being back I have played more golf, gone walking in the dales and the lake district (there is nothing that I saw in Oz that can compare to these in terms of beauty). From where I now live, I can go on day trips to York and Harrogate and go to lovely country pubs for Sunday dinner. I have only been back a year but have already been for weekends away to Prague and Paris, worked in Chicago for a fortnight and am going to Tuscany in June. These sort of opportunities simply do not exist from Australia. Once you are there, it is very long way to anything else.
Don’t get me started on Australian TV (non-stop American reality show imports littered with adverts). The music scene is awful. The food is strictly Greek/Italian or Viet/Thai. Nobody has heard of Tapas. Curries are almost impossible to find. And French food might as well not exist.
A lot of people cite their children as the prime reason for emigrating which I find quite strange. As if a bigger garden and a bit more sunshine is all kids need!
Did i think my friends and colleagues were any happier or more rounded individuals as a result of growing up in Australia? Certainly not. For most of the people I know in Australia, many have rarely been outside the state of Victoria. The vast majority have only been outside of their home country once or twice, generally on a year out working in a bar in London, ‘doing’ all of Europe in a 3 week contiki tour.
Whilst, I count many Australians amongst my best friends, I have to admit that on the whole, the geographic isolation and inward-focused media leaves them relatively uncultured, often quite narrow-minded and occassionally extremely bigotted when compared to people of similar socio-economic backgrounds in the UK. Those that don’t believe me should have been in Oz when the Shappelle Corby case was in the news. The way people I knew (and the country as a whole) reacted to it made me embarrassed to be in the country at the time.
There is massive problems of drug abuse (especially Crystal Meth and Heroin) and gambling is seen as socially acceptable, normal even. People who think that anti-social behaviour is purely a British problem are absolutely deluding themselves. My ‘neighbours’ in Melbourne used to use our stairwell as a urinal. Fights in pubs and on the street are commonplace, often much more violent than in the UK. My girlfriend’s cousin recently had a freind die in her arms from stab wounds inflicted after a fight out in Perth. Another friends of mine has permanent damage to his eyes after a gang jumped him in St Kilda and kicked and scratched and gouged at him, completely unprovoked. Young people get involved in illegal drag-races out in the suburbs every single weekend. If you keep an eye on the local news you may also have heard about the Cronulla race riots, Premier Brack’s daughter recently being taken to A & E after underage binge-drinking and yobs defacing the ANZAC memorial. People who think this stuff doesn’t happen in Australia are, frankly, living in cloud cuckoo land.
Because of the nature of the work I do, most of the people I worked with had been to University. Because of the financial constraints of tertiary education in Australia, the majority of people I knew had both lived at home and worked part time to fund their studies. University was 3 of the best years of my life, mostly as a result of living away from home and being completely immersed in the student way of life. The Australians I know have a massive void in their experience as a result.
I grew up in a small village in a rural area. As a result we had big a massive garden. Did this make my childhood more enjoyable? No. The things I enjoyed most were trips abroad or knowing that I would be able to do what I wanted in life, going away to University and having the world at my feet.
I used to go on holiday at least once a year either with my family or with school. The furthest kids go in Oz is on school camp to Maloooonlongatta or somewhere else completely irrelevant.
For people like myself, young, ambitious and cultured, Australia has very little to offer. From England I may not have the time and money to do everything that I want to do. Trapped in Australia, however, there simply weren’t enough things to keep me occupied. The world is an amazing place, I couldn’t be removed that far removed from it again. People contemplating a move to Oz should really look beyond the beaches and shiny office buildings before they decide to sacrifice all the things they take for granted.
There must be some good sides to oz, my reasons to move to Brisbane as you stated are to give my children a better standard of live, not just for the outside culture, as we go camping quite a few weekends in summer, but this country has nothing to offer for me, husband or my young children, the goverment take most of the money for taxes and then a bit more on top, yet we both work more than full time hours just to keep paying for every tom, dick and harry that they keep letting into 'this fabulous country' that you are so proud of. Maybe we are naive, but is there really anything wrong with wanting to dream of a better place than this hell hole.
Location: Wellington Point, Brisbane from Walney Island, Cumbria
Posts: 55
Hi, welcome back to England. It sounds as though you are disillusioned with your time in Oz. I am not denying that England is a glorious country as far as views and places to go are concerned, but the way it is being run down at the moment does not give me any confidence that it will be a good place for my sons to try and make a good life for themselves and their future families. I know Oz is isolated when you compare it to here and that there is not the same history or culture, but we have seen it here already and want to try something different. England is becoming so much like the USA (gangs, guns, knives, drugs, cut-throat business ideals etc.) that it scares me! The amount of illegal immigrants and also legal ones that only come here to get benefits as we are so soft with them worries me too. If life at home is so hard and dangerous, why is it usually young men who come here....what about their families left behind on their own in the 'dangerous, hard country'? I welcome anyone who wants to work and pay taxes like the rest of us, but not others. I know Oz has it's bad points...I would be stupid to think otherwise, but it can't be as bad as we are heading here.
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STILL NERVOUS, BUT GETTING THERE!:wacko:
There are some good points to Australia and i left behind a lot of good friends, but i can literally count the things i miss about Australia on one hand. The fact of the matter is that I have done much more in one year since returning to the UK then i did in the entire 3 years i was in Australia. It must be a generational thing because I simply don't get it. The kind of response you post stating every 'Tom Dick and Harry' makes me think you are the typical Daily Mail-reading racist expat that'll probably get along fine with the redneck locals in rural Queensland. Australia is a country of immigrants if you hadn't noticed, what do you expect to find there, a Ku Klux Klan convention. Melbourne and Sydney in particular have huge immigrant belts where you wouldn't see many a white face, you would be shocked!
[quote=mandytuck;116105]Hi, welcome back to England. It sounds as though you are disillusioned with your time in Oz. I am not denying that England is a glorious country as far as views and places to go are concerned, but the way it is being run down at the moment does not give me any confidence that it will be a good place for my sons to try and make a
Hi Mandy
After reading this thread I agree with what you say and think you have hit the nail on the head. We are not going for the sunshine and the beaches. We are going because like you said the UK has changed so much and not for the best. I have educated children with degrees and sadly my daughter can not even get a job.
I know one thing when you work in Australia you are better thought of, in the UK this is not the case. You don't go to school you get incentives here, you do go to school and work hard you get nothing. If you know how to work the benefits system you are sorted and believe me I know. After working for NHS for 21 years and seeing the changes I would not say they are for the best.
My family are going to Australia to work and be appreciated for what we do. My children are not babies but educated people who deserve better and I feel the UK can not offer this anymore.
There are some good points to Australia and i left behind a lot of good friends, but i can literally count the things i miss about Australia on one hand. The fact of the matter is that I have done much more in one year since returning to the UK then i did in the entire 3 years i was in Australia. It must be a generational thing because I simply don't get it. The kind of response you post stating every 'Tom Dick and Harry' makes me think you are the typical Daily Mail-reading racist expat that'll probably get along fine with the redneck locals in rural Queensland. Australia is a country of immigrants if you hadn't noticed, what do you expect to find there, a Ku Klux Klan convention. Melbourne and Sydney in particular have huge immigrant belts where you wouldn't see many a white face, you would be shocked!
Sorry Gags
I think you are wrong. I am not racist and never have been, In my line of work I deal with lots of different nationalities and may I say with respect. I supposebly live on the outskirts of one of the worst cities in the UK (HULL). Life has changed so much and yes we do have a lot of different nationalities living in the UK who will do jobs that a lot of people won't. Maybe a few years down the line you may wonder why you ever came back.
How would you feel if you had a child who was beat up just because they didn't like the way he was dressed. This was by a group white youths who had been drinking. If they had got him on the floor they would of killed him.
Please don't judge us when you don't know why we want to leave the UK.
thanks for your post gags - very interesting to read. one downside of this forum i find is that it is for poms looking to move to oz so not many poms who have been in oz for years write on it - would be very interesting to hear from lots of poms who have been in oz long term. youhave definitely given me lots to think about. i agree i too have rose tinted glasses on - but a lot of that to do with wanting it to be better! i try not to think about the deadly snakes, spiders, termites that literally eat homes, the drought that is very very serious and lots of other potentially negative things. i just need to go and see what its like - the one thing your post has made us do though is we are going to put our stuff into storage in the uk and wait until we are there and then make a decision whether or not to ship stuff across or come back - so thank you again for your post - good to hear real experiences in oz.
There are some good points to Australia and i left behind a lot of good friends, but i can literally count the things i miss about Australia on one hand. The fact of the matter is that I have done much more in one year since returning to the UK then i did in the entire 3 years i was in Australia. It must be a generational thing because I simply don't get it. The kind of response you post stating every 'Tom Dick and Harry' makes me think you are the typical Daily Mail-reading racist expat that'll probably get along fine with the redneck locals in rural Queensland. Australia is a country of immigrants if you hadn't noticed, what do you expect to find there, a Ku Klux Klan convention. Melbourne and Sydney in particular have huge immigrant belts where you wouldn't see many a white face, you would be shocked!
Gags
I read your original post with interest - I entirely agree people often deal with the whole emigration issue with blinkers on and many will get a few very nasty surprises when they return to the real world.
However, the later response to Mel simply makes me think you're one of the many people who take pleasure in coming onto sites such as PIO and intentionally raining on people's parades - treating people who you know nothing whatsoever about as if they're everything you despise in life. It's not a great behavioural trait.
The choice to emigrate or even to return to the UK is entirely down to individuals and people's experiences can be very different. You certainly should not be judging everyone else on your own jaded view.
I for example am 26 years old, grew up for 17 years in Harrogate (day trip? pah! not for me again) and now live in York. I am intelligent and well educated and have a good, well paid job. However, I also like my life extremely laid back and Oz will suit just fine thank you very much. If it doesn't I'll return to the UK and continue not to make assumptions about other people.
If I've read you wrong, I apologise, but if that's the case you should probably be a bit more careful what you put in print.
__________________ Abi&Dan :jiggy:
Things are going to get a lot worse before they get a lot worse - Lily Tomlin
Once again you seemed to of judged incorrectly, I am by no means a racist, and I have many friends of different backgrounds and races, and everyone is free to move around the world as the next person, everyone is free to have an opionion also, this is the first ever post that I have felt so strongly about, every country has its faults, and no where is perfect, my point been with the Tom, Dick and Harry comment is that we have our own people struggling to survice yet we give these people an easy ride when entering our country. If they made it as hard to get here as it is to enter other countries maybe I and other people would not feel so bitter, but I resent the fact that you have judged me as racist !!!!!!! You could not be further from the truth.
